Thursday, October 27, 2005

CRC's Latest Lie: A Sudden Realization

Ah, I just realized something. The Citizens for a Responsible Curriculum web site this week has an ugly statement, sour-grapes thing, where among other things Michelle Turner says:
TTF has become the front for GLSEN - Gay Lesbian Straight Education Network.

TTF is us, of course, Teach the Facts. We blew it off, but last night I started wondering, where in the world did they get that?

And then it hit me.

Last week the Teach the Facts Yahoo group got an email from somebody at GLSEN, asking "when your next conference call was taking place." David Fishback responded to this, saying, "I will contact you off-listserve. Conference calls have not be under the auspices of Teachthefacts.org."

(Sorry David, it wouldn't have been ethical to correct your spelling.)

TeachTheFacts.org doesn't have any conference call. My assumption, which I believe is correct, was that somebody over at GLSEN got confused. The email appeared to come from somebody trying to find some information for their boss, and it looks like they just asked in the wrong place. It sounded like Mr. Fishback knew what was going on and was going to deal with it, and that was the end of that, as far as Teach The Facts is concerned.

Not that we owe the world an explanation, but I was wondering myself, where they got this particular weird accusation.

Anyway, listen. We know that CRC long ago planted moles on our Yahoo group to spy on us. Whatever, we got no secrets, they've been listening in all year. Apparently they saw this email, and not really knowing anything that's going on, they reported back that we had some super-double-deep-undercover intrigue happening with GLSEN.

Which of course makes us a "front" for that organization. I suppose that was their best guess, given the evidence ... Take one misdirected email and construct an entire conspiracy theory out of it.

Just for the record, we got nothing against GLSEN, they seem like a great organization, and I'm sure they're paying attention to what's going on here in Montgomery County. They are welcome to join our group and participate in our conversation (if they haven't already), just like CRC does. And nobody should be surprised that the gay advocacy organizations keep a close eye on what's happening here. I would if I were them, because the outcome of this controversy will affect them.

It has been my impression that some of the GLBT groups are monitoring our county's controversy very closely, but are staying out of it so far.

We are not surprised when CRC makes stuff up, we see it in the papers all the time, but just to be clear: TeachTheFacts.org is not a "front" for GLSEN, or for anybody else.

33 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

At least GLSEN, an organization that is comprised of many trained educators, has the welfare of all students as a part of its mission, unlike the "concerns" of the bogus and yucky "PFOX" homophobes. And, I might add, it certainly is no badge of honor for CRC to be affiliated in any way with the very creepy Focus on the Family (sic)weirdos!!
Bob

October 28, 2005 10:36 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The Citizens for a Responsible Curriculum web site this week has an ugly statement"

Jim

This is the kind of thing you always do. Even if untrue, is this an "ugly statement"? You said yourself that GLSEN is a great organization, so why is it ugly to say you're working with them? This dilutes the language and degrades the conversation.

The school board has chosen your group as a "community representative". Personally, I'd question the basis of that designation but I also thinks it entails some accountability to that community. Could you answer the following?:

1. Are you an organization or just a website?

2. How many members do you have?

3. Who is on your Board of Directors?

4. Who is on your Executive Committee?

5. What type of organization are you?

6. Are you registered with the state?

7. Have you filed with the IRS and, if so, under what paragraph?

8. Do you have any employees other than your web administrator?

9. Do you pay the web administrator or his time donated?

10. How many cash donations have you received?

11. What other organizations have contributed services (such as consulting)?

Thanks in advance

Lightning

October 28, 2005 10:37 AM  
Blogger JimK said...

Lightning, the statement was ugly, not necessarily the part I quoted. The part I quoted was just a plain vanilla lie. They had several paragraphs of stuff about us and about the nasty old board who just wants to pick on them. Sorry if that was not clear. They're blowing off steam over there, and it's not hard to see why, but it's not especially pretty to look at.

As far as your questions, this stuff is on the public record. We are incorporated in the state of Maryland as a non-profit (501 c3) group. Here are our officers:
President: James Kennedy
VP: Andrea Kline
Secretay: Amy Heyman
Treasurer: Chris Grewell

Board of Directors
Letitia Hall
Faye Newsham
Dana Beyer

We're legal and above-board. Now, let's talk about the issues.

JimK

October 28, 2005 11:05 AM  
Blogger andrear said...

Hey, why do we have to be the front for someone else- Why can't other groups be fronting for us?? Like the DNC or PFAW or NSAL(North Shore Animal League- did very good work for animals after Katrina) . That's the rumor I am going to try to spread - that the DNC/PFAW/MOVEON/NAFTA/UN are all fronts for TTF.

Andrea

October 28, 2005 1:35 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jim

Why don't you ever delete Andrea's rantings?

October 28, 2005 1:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"President: James Kennedy
VP: Andrea Kline
Secretay: Amy Heyman
Treasurer: Chris Grewell

Board of Directors
Letitia Hall
Faye Newsham
Dana Beyer"

Well, what's Fishback's involvement? Why is GLSEN mistakenly sending e-mail to him c/o TTF? Are you a Fishback front? Are you his surrogate on the new committee?

October 28, 2005 1:49 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

Why don't you ever delete Andrea's rantings?

Because she's cute, I guess.

Look, here's the actual rule: don't irritate me. It's not fair, but you can figure it out. This is the rule that underlies all systems of law: don't piss off The Man. All the legal codes are just elaborations on that.

JimK

October 28, 2005 1:52 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

Yeah, man, the aliens sent me to earth to serve their wishes, channeled through Fishback and sent to me by extra-high-frequency brain-wave messages ...

David Fishback was the chair of the previous citizens committee. He is a member of our Yahoo group, participates in a lot of our discussions and meetings, and he's our friend. We initially formed to support the curriculum that was developed under his leadership, and he has a lot to offer our group, but he's not a corporate officer.

I don't know why this person at GLSEN sent email to TTF, and I don't know what it had to do with David, if anything, but he seemed to know what to do. I didn't ask about it, and forgot all about it until last night.

You sure have a lot of questions, don't you? You must appreciate that I consider these snoopy and intrusive but am answering you anyway, just to be nice.

JimK

October 28, 2005 2:12 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, you get irritated by people disagreeing with you and you're supposed to be a community representative.

Don't be hypocritical. She's very shrill!

No comment on appearance.

October 28, 2005 2:12 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

I am usually amused by people who disagree with me, and pleased when they do it in an articulate, intelligent, or interesting way. I'm not going to delete anybody's comments because they took the opposite point of view -- look, this isn't the CRC Forum. We're not afraid of other points of view here.

The delete key works on everybody the same way. Remember, I've already threatened myself with it.

JimK

October 28, 2005 2:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Yeah, man, the aliens sent me to earth to serve their wishes, channeled through Fishback and sent to me by extra-high-frequency brain-wave messages ...

David Fishback was the chair of the previous citizens committee. He is a member of our Yahoo group, participates in a lot of our discussions and meetings, and he's our friend. We initially formed to support the curriculum that was developed under his leadership, and he has a lot to offer our group, but he's not a corporate officer.

I don't know why this person at GLSEN sent email to TTF, and I don't know what it had to do with David, if anything, but he seemed to know what to do. I didn't ask about it, and forgot all about it until last night.

You sure have a lot of questions, don't you? You must appreciate that I consider these snoopy and intrusive but am answering you anyway, just to be nice."

This is all sounding fishier and fishier. What about that group that you're finding embarassing to disclose? All this elusiveness is going to start some rumors.

I forgot to ask: Could you post a copy of your application to join the CAC? for posterity's sake; Kids in the future are going to want to read all your writings.

October 28, 2005 2:18 PM  
Blogger Kay2898 said...

Anonymous said
Why is GLSEN mistakenly sending e-mail to him c/o TTF?



Ask GLSEN....



Anonymous continued:
Are you a Fishback front? Are you his surrogate on the new committee?


Oh my what a hilarious statement and a sure bet CRC and their supporters will be spouting that funny one. HA HA HA HA

Will we see that next in Michele Turner's public statements for CRC? Everything is a conspiracy you know in CRC world.


Who knew David was suspected of such skullduggery? Jim right along with him....?????? Too funny....

Well anon...Jim will dispell that rumor pretty quickly. He will gladly let everyone know the he is a "celebrity" and "dictator" of this fine blog that hosts CRC'rs as posters too since their own message board sucks and he feels sorry for them.

How more inclusive can that be?

Now I am kind of worried that Jim might be a front for CRC. In fact I think we may start that rumor...Naaahhh. CRC can do that.

October 28, 2005 2:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Now I am kind of worried that Jim might be a front for CRC."

Very good, Kay. It only took you eleven months to figure that out!

007

October 28, 2005 2:30 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

Anon

I hope we have not made anyone think that we never develop strategies for getting our message across. We have reason to keep some of our discussions private, and there is no reason to assume that we need to publish everything we say and do on the Internet. I have been extremely candid with you, in fact I would guess that some of my colleagues have probably exchanged some email today along the lines of "What the &*@#! does he think he's doing?!?!?!"

We've got nothing to hide, no big secrets, but we do have to exercise some restraint at times, and it is not always in our best interest to tell the whole world everything we think, say, or do. You can make that sound as suspicious as you like, but it's just a fact of life. That's why we have a group, so we can make plans and so that when we do something it is more effective than what a solitary person could accomplish. We have many different people, with different beliefs and different skills, and they all jump in at different times. That's really cool. But it's not going to be an open book.

And so ... I think I have humored your curiosity more than enough. If you'd like to start rumors, I can point you to a neat little web site where lies are the norm. Go ahead and start something.

JimK

October 28, 2005 2:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

OK, Jim, just don't complain anymore when CRC does the same thing.

How about disclosing the secret communication between you and the board that convinced them to put you on the CAC? When are we going to get a look at it? Remember the kids. If you put it on the web, it never goes away. The spooky board probably already shredded it.

October 28, 2005 2:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"their own message board sucks"

this is a crass pornographic phrase

please delete it

October 28, 2005 2:44 PM  
Blogger Kay2898 said...

Funny one Anon...and tells us all that you and other CRC'rs are really bothered by Jim being on there. You go Jim...!!!

Yes Jim has BOE totally under his control and he actually pays them under the BOE table... wink... wink. Oops CRC and pals will be calling IRS. I better not say that.

October 28, 2005 2:50 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

I'll decide if I'm offended by something, and delete on the basis of that. This word is commonly used, regarded as acceptable in normal conversation, and doesn't offend me.

Please feel free to alert me if there is something offensive that I might not have noticed, a subtle slur or something. I will balance offensiveness with the significance of a message's content in judging.

I just thought of this. I suppose, because of the nature of the opposition to the sex-ed curriculum, we may get some commenters here who are extremely ... prudish. Sorry, we're not going to make everybody speak with the vocabulary of a ten year old. (Actually, a ten-year-old would say this.)

JimK

October 28, 2005 2:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Kay

There has to be an explanation why an organization with scant public support is put on the CAC. Oh that's right, TTF kept telling them they did a great job last time out when they embarassed the county on a national level.

Oh well, at least andrea won't have to stand in the rain anymore.

October 28, 2005 2:57 PM  
Blogger Kay2898 said...

Jim K said:

(Actually, a ten-year-old would say this.)

***************

They can and do say worse.

Remember the cute kid at PC in the last BOE meeting talking about hugging his brother in daycare, etc., and the other kids immediately started teasing them and calling them gay?



Using gay as a derogatory method even by kids is far worse. You hear kids even younger that 10 saying "That so gay.." or "You are gay.." as if that is the most horrible thing on this planet.

Those kids have to learn that somewhere and not necessarily at school.

October 28, 2005 3:06 PM  
Blogger Kay2898 said...

Anonymous said...


Kay

There has to be an explanation why an organization with scant public support is put on the CAC. Oh that's right, TTF kept telling them they did a great job last time out when they embarassed the county on a national level.

*******************

Not other than they (TTF) applied and complied to all requirements for community group who represents a larger public support. But hey a group could represent 10 and still get on if they met all criteria.

CRC now that would be who? Oh yeah the ones who left a public record of lying about a "last minute" lawsuit and more as well as sending bogus threat letters to people as if they CRC/RECALL) think they are above criticism on their very public homophobic and bigot stances. Let's not forget their background start as "RECALL THE MONTGOMERY SCHOOL BOARD...."

and


Let not forget CRC'rs having email addresses saying:

The safest way to use an email addres without people being able to "track you down" is to get an email address from the recall site. Intially I provided our group with "recall" email addresses for this specific reason. Those addresses that have been set up are:

al.jackson@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
barry.lyons@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
ben.patton@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
bunny.galladora@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
dominic.tondo@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
ellen.castellano@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
jeannie.tondo@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
john.garza@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
john.mitchell@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
mary.healy@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
michelle.turner@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
robin.mtichell@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
samara.mendoza@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
steina.walter@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
support@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
theresa.rickman@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
tony.castellano@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
volunteer@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com
steve.fisher@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com

If anyone needs a "recall" email address, which will not point to you individually, please email me at support@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com and I will set up your new email address and provide instructions on how to get your email program to use this new address.

JOB

[Date=02-02-2005] Name:job support@recallmontgomeryschoolboard.com,

October 28, 2005 3:24 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

October 28, 2005 3:35 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

See. That didn't hurt a bit, did it?

JimK

October 28, 2005 3:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"But hey a group could represent 10 and still get on if they met all criteria."

That's an oxymoronic statement. If they represented 10 people, they wouldn't be representing the community as state law requires. Oh well, Liberty Counsel will soon be on the case.

I think a lot of community members are not being represented. Let's pick one at random: where's the working class Hispanic who goes to mass every weekend and takes what he hears seriously.

October 28, 2005 3:44 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jim

We need to know if you approve using this term in health class. This can't be dodged by deleting people that ask you tough questions.

October 28, 2005 3:46 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

The term has no part in a health curriculum, as you well know. Your question is sarcastic.

If a high school kid in a discussion says, wow, that sucks, I don't think they need to be expelled from school. Even in health class.

JimK

October 28, 2005 3:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The delete key works on everybody the same way. Remember, I've already threatened myself with it."

Yeah, you probably scared yourself too. I hear people with multiple personalities sometimes do that.

October 28, 2005 4:15 PM  
Blogger JimK said...

I'll leave that, as an attempt at humor, even though it is without content.

JimK

October 28, 2005 4:17 PM  
Blogger Kay2898 said...

Anonymous said...
"But hey a group could represent 10 and still get on if they met all criteria."

That's an oxymoronic statement. If they represented 10 people, they wouldn't be representing the community as state law requires.
*****************8

Sure they would....A community of 10 who work on behalf of people with similar views.

October 28, 2005 4:20 PM  
Blogger Kay2898 said...

Anonymous said....Are you a Fishback front?




Who is fronting for whom????

********************

Minutes of 2/3/05 Meeting

Citizens for a Responsible Curriculum


Excerpt 1

There is another group in Ohio, the CCV (Citizens for Community Values) www.ccv.org, that was able to affect curriculum in Ohio and started as a grassroots effort, like ours(CRC). We(CRC) met with them and they had quite a bit of advice, and importantly, a liability letter on the dangers of homosexuality that we (CRC) can use to present to the BOE.


Excerpt 2

Steve Dirlick from the Republican National Committee was in attendance and talked about his training at grass roots organizations training – he indicated we were on the right track



**********************************




Minutes of 2/10/05 Meeting

Citizens for a Responsible Curriculum


Excerpt 1

Steve (Fisher) indicated that we should ask CCV how they handled NPR if they got requests.

October 28, 2005 9:39 PM  
Blogger Alex K. said...

Wow.

Personal attacks are not cool.

We learned about them in school the other day.

They're called "logical fallacies".

You know who you are, figure it out.

October 28, 2005 9:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"There has to be an explanation why an organization with scant public support is put on the CAC."

You haven't figured that out yet? The reason the two groups with the most scant public support in Montgomery County got seats on the CAC was to settle their meritless lawsuit at the lowest possible cost to MCPS. Of course these booby prizes don't matter much as they already had seats on the committee. These seats, along with $36,000.00 in educational funding taken from their own children who supposedly attend our schools, is what they call a "win." And they claim this "win" at the same time they claim they are all about helping MCPS students.

HINT: It is NOT helpful to take funding away from those you claim to want to help.

In the court of public opinion, this "win" makes their public support within Montgomery County even more scant.

Ma

October 29, 2005 1:56 PM  
Blogger andrear said...

No one need worry about my standing or sitting in the rain or snow or summer heat. I started being political when I was 15 and don't plan to stop- like the Ragin' Grannies, I'll be there with my sign and my candle "when I'm 85". I don't suppose there will be a time when I stop marching until I just can't anymore. You anons can think what you want- but remember- We never got up and told the BOE we loved them like CRC's Garza (literally). And no TTF officer or member of our Board closely tied to any BOE member- CRC cannot say the same!

October 29, 2005 7:05 PM  

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