Monday, June 02, 2008

Gigantic Shower-Nut Protest

Equality Maryland held its annual Night Out For Equality at the Bethesda Marriott last night, and Christine from TTF was there with her camera to record the gigantic protest outside. Let me fill in. Equality Maryland is a group that supports gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender rights in our state. Though a number of groups and lots of volunteers participated, Equality Maryland is really the group who really mobilized the drive to scrutinize the petition signatures in the recent effort to relegalize discrimination against transgender people in Montgomery County. I'm guessing that's the reason this protest was held outside their gala.

If you haven't been following this, our County Council recently added the term "gender identity" to the existing nondiscrimination law, along with race, religion, sexual orientation, and other things. A small group of people announced that their morals were offended, it was against their religion to be fair to transgender people, and then they started saying that the law would allow ill-intentioned men -- predators, perverts, and pedophiles -- to lurk in ladies' shower-rooms. We noted last week a group in Colorado using exactly this argument to fight gay rights out there. It is very persuasive because nobody wants to have creepy men in the ladies room, and nobody has the time to go look it up.

Here is a picture of one of the protesters last night. If you can't see it, her sign says, "It's Pool Time! But who will you and your children see in the showers?"

Here's the main part of the protest. Christine says there were as many as seven people there.

Ah, this would be Cynthia chatting with a protester. Remember when the "transgender gangs" were harassing petition signature collectors? Here's one of the gang members. Notice the tattoos, the bulging muscles, the leather. Cynthia is very intimidating.

It's hard to read this guy's sign. I blew up the picture and it seems to say "Liberty Lost" at the top in big letters, actually the whole thing is "Will Montgomery County be the first in Maryland [fingers in the way] all special rights for those with gender identity DISORDER [unclear]." Then underneath it lists things like "Lost privacy in restroom and showers," "lost security for our children from predators," lost ability to choose roommates on basis of [unclear]," lost freedom for small business to decide," "lost religious freedom in hiring teachers and staff," and "lost community standards of decency." Then at the bottom again it says "Stand for liberty."


Some of the protesters stood on the other side of the road. Christine wanted to be fair and include the entire mass of people in a photograph. Here they are. I'm not sure what the cops were doing there. The guy in the suit is not a protester, that's somebody attending the gala. You can see there are crowds of demonstrators on both sides of the street.

Finally, another shot of the demonstration.

Now and then one of the shower-nuts comments here and says we are exaggerating their concern with the showers. Their web site, by the way, is notmyshower.net.

The bill is about gender identity, it protects people who may not meet others' expectations for how you present yourself as a male or female. It has nothing to do with sexual behavior, only with that dimension of self-presentation that defines us socially as male or female. The law says nothing about who can use a restroom or locker-room, but there are laws against exhibitionism, voyeurism, and sexual assault that apply already and will continue to apply. Women can currently use the men's room when the ladies-room line goes down the hall, and they will still be able to. If somebody wants to pass a law against that, they can propose it and lobby for it, but the gender identity nondiscrimination law doesn't say anything about it.

I didn't attend the gala, but understand that a splendid time was had by all. Early word is that the event raised a lot of money for the nondiscrimination campaign. This is an expensive deal, there's work for volunteers but the real work is going to be done by lawyers, and they aren't cheap. There will be a hearing this month in a suit against the MoCo Board of Elections for certifying bad petition signatures; if that succeeds, then good, the bill goes into law. If the judge rules in favor of the Board though, and this goes to election, a very expensive public education campaign will be necessary -- who knows anything about gender identity? If the people are going to vote on it, they will have to be made to understand what the issues are, they'll have to understand something about sex and gender, they will have to understand that it's about discrimination and not about showers.

47 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wow... could bigots look anymore pathetic? I think they win the prize for "the saddest of the sad".

Again, I am starting to see the similarities between CRC/G and the Westboro Baptist Church become even more evident. The citizens of Montgomery County are seeing this as well (just wait, it'll soon be out).

They says that they are not anti-gay but they protest such events.

Sad little haters...

June 02, 2008 7:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just in case anyone is wondering, the leather Jim mentions above would be the black strappy part of my shoes. They got video of me while I was there, so hopefully they’ll have MUCH better pictures of me for their propaganda. (If you go to http://www.mcpscurriculum.com/ and hit the “Blogging” tab, then “Blog,” you’ll be taken to http://www.jerryweast.com/ where you can find an article called “The Browskirts are Coming!” (I think he meant “Brownskirts.”) Lacking good pictures of the “transgender gang,” he apparently felt compelled to use pictures of Nazis as a substitute. As several of the people intimately involved with the passage of the 23-07 bill are of Jewish heritage, I’m sure they just loved this characterization of their efforts.

Peace,

Cynthia

June 02, 2008 8:07 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It's a very close race. Kinda of like the one between Barack O-bomb-a and Hillary. Have more people protested with CRG or have more people commented on the TTF androgynut blog? What do scientific studies say?

"The bill is about gender identity, it protects people who may not meet others' expectations for how you present yourself as a male or female."

Protection is a vague term here. The bill deals with social consequences of outlandish behavior. Why do gender outlaws deserve more protection from social stigma than others "who may not meet others' expectations"?

There's really no reason. It shouldn't be a matter of governmental concern in a free society.

"The law says nothing about who can use a restroom or locker-room,"

Actually, it's not an official law until the referendum is dealt with. The proposed law does say something "about who can use a restroom or locker-room", however. It says the owner of the facility can't make his own policy concerning gender segregation and must not discriminate between those who say they are female and those who actually are.

"If somebody wants to pass a law against that, they can propose it and lobby for it, but the gender identity nondiscrimination law doesn't say anything about it."

CRG doesn't.

"I didn't attend the gala,"

What a blow to local lunacy.

"who knows anything about gender identity? If the people are going to vote on it, they will have to be made to understand what the issues are, they'll have to understand something about sex and gender,"

Makes you wonder why "Teach the Facts" isn't chomping at the bit hoping this referendum will give them an opportunity to teach their version of the "facts".

June 02, 2008 8:16 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Makes you wonder why "Teach the Facts" isn't chomping at the bit hoping this referendum will give them an opportunity to teach their version of the "facts"."

Yeah, go figure.

June 02, 2008 8:19 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To the last two "Anonymous" posters: your snide and supercillious remarks identify you as the pathetic, ill-educated, bigoted, hateful people you really are. Loved the poster your pitiful CRG group had done for you by Focus on the Family (sic.)...the usual litany of lies and slanders. Like the Westboro fanatics...the more you expose yourself to public scrutiny, the more you turn off Montgomery County's intelligent residents. You are LOSERS!
RT

June 02, 2008 8:35 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Resist Andronuttery said:

“Actually, it's not an official law until the referendum is dealt with. The proposed law does say something "about who can use a restroom or locker-room", however. It says the owner of the facility can't make his own policy concerning gender segregation and must not discriminate between those who say they are female and those who actually are.”

RA, can you please point out the paragraph to me in 23-07 that says “the owner of the facility can’t make his own policy concerning gender segregation”? I was entirely unable to find it in my copy of 23-07. The information I found on this topic comes from the Health and Human Services committee memo and says the exact opposite, with an agreement by the County Attorney:

“The County Attorney’s Office concluded that Bill 23-07 as introduced would not require or prohibit restroom designation according to gender identity or biological gender (see memorandum on © 17). This means that an employer or other public facility provider could maintain and enforce current gender based restrictions on public facility use.”

Also, in the very first paragraph of this memo, in the statement by the committee itself:

“Therefore, the Committee members now unanimously recommends that Bill 23-07 not amend the exception from the current public accommodations law for “distinctly private or personal” facilities. The result is that the operators of those types of facilities would continue to designate those who can use them.”

Peace,

Cynthia

June 02, 2008 8:47 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

First it was the Reverend Jeremiah Wright, and now the Reverend Michael Pfleger. What's with Obama's crackpot preacher pals?

One is white and one is black. And there are probably more of them that the Obama campaign is trying to muzzle as we speak. But does Obama seem peculiarly unfortunate in his choice of mentors and allies, or is there an ideological basis to what these preachers are saying?

Chicago, where Obama is from, is the capital of what may be called the Black Liberation Theology movement in the United States. This movement is a legacy of the 1960s, and has more to do with Malcolm X than Martin Luther King.

Malcolm X, you may recall, denounced Christianity as a racist religion which had created what he called a "blond, blue-eyed Jesus." Malcolm X called on blacks to repudiate this bigoted religion. He himself embraced the Nation of Islam with its own peculiar theology.

Some black activists, notably a theologian named James Cone, agreed with Malcolm X. But their solution was not to abandon Christianity. Rather, they countered what they saw as the white man's Christianity with a kind of black equivalent. In this view, Christ was not blond and blue eyed but rather black and Afrocentric. Picture Christ with an Afro and dashiki leading a revolutionary liberation movement against the white Pharoahs and you'll get the picture.

Cone and others spearheaded a new interpretation of the Bible which is now read as a story of emancipation from white racist oppression. Unfortunately what black liberation theology does is to take all the old racial stereotypes and simply invert them. Consequently the new theology was no less race-conscious and prejudiced than the one it sought to replace.

The Reverend Jeremiah Wright explicitly associates himself with black liberation theology. I don't know about Pfleger, but his rhetoric also reflects the same themes. Ironically there are some whites like Pfleger who are attracted to the doctrine of white oppressors and black martyrs. Presumably these whites hope that by allying themselves with black virtue they can escape the moral stigma of being white.

Obama and his campaign managers have been trying to promote the lie that this bizarre cult of black liberation theology is actually mainstream teaching in the black church. And again there is a strain of condescending white liberalism that is quick to agree. "Yes, of course they say crazy things in the black church, Mildred, but you have to understand the terrible things those people have been through."

In reality you only have to sample black churches across the country to see that this is a calumny against black Christians, who are mostly traditional in their understanding of the Bible and who don't spend their Sundays chanting "God damn America!"

I'm relieved that Obama has finally summoned the good sense to quit the Reverend Wright's Trinity Church. Ultimately what Obama needs to repudiate is not only the odd Reverend who happens to embarrass his campaign but the racist ideology that calls itself black liberation theology.

June 02, 2008 8:50 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Loved the poster your pitiful CRG group had done for you by Focus on the Family (sic.)...the usual litany of lies and slanders. Like the Westboro fanatics...the more you expose yourself to public scrutiny, the more you turn off Montgomery County's intelligent residents. You are LOSERS!"

RT

You're confused. Westboro is a fringe group which supports radical policies. CRG simply supports maintaining the status quo and allowing citizens to conduct their affairs free of governmental interference.

Regardless of their views, the problem with extremists is their extremism. In that regard, TTF more closely resembles Westboro than CRG.

June 02, 2008 10:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Andrea- not anon
Same Ol' Anon, please leave your pres. campaign crap somewhere else.

June 02, 2008 10:34 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"This means that an employer or other public facility provider could maintain and enforce current gender based restrictions on public facility use."

We've gone over this before, Cynth. Yes, the proposal will allow gender segregation, according to county officials, but it codifies the definition of gender as expression and thus will not allow one to forbid biological males to use the ladies room if they express themselves as females.

Do really not realize that?

June 02, 2008 10:37 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Did you know that polls are now showing a McCain-Huckabee ticket beating any combination of Democrats, Andrea?

Did you know we are now winning the war in Iraq and that general Petraeus now is planning to withdraw more troops than the surge?

That was really the Democrats's only issue and it's quickly fading.

June 02, 2008 10:41 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

AnonFreak just gets even more and more freaky!

June 02, 2008 10:54 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

very insightful and convincing, Derrick

you must be a debating champ

June 02, 2008 11:04 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I sure am, AnonFreak!

You much be a champion bigot (of course you are)!

We're doing current events today in my class and so far five students have talked about the Gala this past weekend. Not one of them has mentioned the protesters...that must be because, as per usual, they made no impact (because people know them as the Parents and Friends of the Westboro Baptist Church). And, no, AnonFreak, I do not discuss homosexuality, ex-gay (fake) therapy, etc, etc, etc in my classes. You see, our students know how to think for themselves.


Obviously.

June 02, 2008 11:34 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The latest from the bigots of PFOX:



Learn about the origins of homosexual behavior by clicking on the video at:

http://www.homosexuality101.com

Parents and Friends of Ex-Gays & Gays
PFOX
Box 561, Fort Belvoir VA 22060
703-360-2225
pfox at pfox.org
www.pfox.org

June 02, 2008 12:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"We're doing current events today in my class and so far five students have talked about the Gala this past weekend."

Derrick

The top current events of last weekend were:

1. Democratic hypocrisy on voter representation in Michigan and Florida

2. Dramatic drop in violence in Iraq in May 2008

3. Discovery that Mars probe landed on ice

Any student who thinks the gay rights gala was a major event isn't receiving much of an education.

June 02, 2008 1:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What PFOX fails to note (as does the author and speaker of the video they tout, Julie H-H) is that she is the incoming president of NARTH. She describes herself on her site and in her video as a licensed therapist and college professor, when she is in fact a leading activist for the leading reparative therapy/ex-gay organization in the US.

Even Warren Throckmorton disagrees with her statement that there are two major schools of thought on why people are born gay: In-born or choice. He rightly points out that no legitimate speaker says that people are LGBT by choice. This issue for research to determine is the environment/experience/genetic set of questions. She discredits herself on the face of what she says.

June 02, 2008 1:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"no legitimate speaker says that people are LGBT by choice"

Well, of course not. Then, they wouldn't be "legitimate".

See, we've fixed things up nice and tidy here in TTFLand.

June 02, 2008 3:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Silly anonymous

Even the "ex-gay" organizations now say being queer isn't a choice but a result of childhood experiences; if they said it were a choice, they would have no customers, because even lgbt people who buy the guilt and shame that drives the ex-gay movement wouldn't buy it: they know they didn't choose to be gay.

Leaving PFOX and some of the more radical Narthists aside, go check out reparative therapy and transformation ministry websites. You'll see what I mean. Start with Exodus.

Then again, go ahead and stay home and spin your sarcastic electronic webs.

Nice to hear about the annual meeting. Cheers to TTF and the good work that you do.

rrjr

June 02, 2008 4:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Start with Exodus."

I met a couple of ex-gays from there a couple of years ago. They seemed fine to me.

You sure all your horror stories aren't just hallucinations? It's not unheard of and therapy is available.

"Then again, go ahead and stay home and spin your sarcastic electronic webs."

Now, now, Robert. Let's not be bitter.

"Nice to hear about the annual meeting. Cheers to TTF and the good work that you do."

Yeah, sounds like a classy joint for an ann-y'all me-tin!

Bottoms up, no matter what y'mateys are drinkin'!

Maybe TTF can make a commercial about identity theft!

!

!

!

June 02, 2008 5:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The thing is, AnonFreak.

If someone in the TTF group had a southern accent, we would not make fun of it like you bigots would. We accept those who are different but just don't like it when people lie to the public via fear mongering and lies (CRC/G and PFOX).

"Ex-" gay therapy is a sham and it only ruins the lives of those who are not informed. Shame on PFOX (CRC/G) for taking advantage of our children and misinformed.

June 02, 2008 5:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

AnonFreak said, "Any student who thinks the gay rights gala was a major event isn't receiving much of an education."

Really...so keeping up with community, state and world affairs is not a doing students any justice? Well, I guess that is how G.W. Bush got to where he is... ignorance, lies, hate, oil, money and, of course, his daddy!

See, we would like to think that children should be taught the tools to be life-long learners and think for themselves instead of just believing everything they see on some anti-different culture website or a heard of "conform-or-die" protesters like CRC/G, PFOX and their pals at the Westboro Baptist Church.

So, how often do you go to www.godhatesfags.com to get your information, AnonFreak? As your postings appear, it must be your home page!

Alright, I have a final exam to make so I am "off-blog".

¡Qué les vaya bien!

June 02, 2008 5:37 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "The bill deals with social consequences of outlandish behavior.".

Transmen and transwomen behave just as genetic men and women do, there is nothing outlandish about our behviour.

Red Baron said "Why do gender outlaws deserve more protection from social stigma than others "who may not meet others' expectations"?".

We have a gender, we are not outlaws. We don't seek more protection than anyone else, we seek the same protection as everyone else. Just as you religionists are protected from discrimination so do trans people deserve to be. Just as Blacks who don't meet the expectations of some whites are protected from discrimination so do trans people deserve equal protection.


Anyone who "who may not meet other's expectations" who is not hurting people deserves protection. LGBTs are a historically oppressed group that is why redress of that injustice is necessary through the law. If you know of anyother harmless group that has been historically oppressed I'm sure LGBT's will support you in calling for an end to their discrimination.

June 02, 2008 5:52 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "Did you know that polls are now showing a McCain-Huckabee ticket beating any combination of Democrats, Andrea?".


Lol, you're still living in your dream world. Polls show just the opposite:

4 hours ago -

http://blogs.usatoday.com/onpolitics/2008/06/gallup-obama-cl.html

Democrat Barack Obama leads Republican John McCain 49%-44% among "likely" voters, the latest USA TODAY/Gallup Poll shows. Democrat Hillary Rodham Clinton leads McCain 48%-44% among likely voters

June 02, 2008 6:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Priya,

I was referring to polls that match up tickets rather than individual candidates. McCain-Huckabee has recently emerged as the strongest ticket.

Pay attention next time.

June 02, 2008 10:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"think for themselves"

You've yet to show any signs of doing this yourself.

"instead of just believing everything they see on some anti-different culture website or a heard of "conform-or-die" protesters like CRC/G, PFOX"

Actually, both of those groups have members representing a wide range of views on many subjects.

"and their pals at the Westboro Baptist Church"

The hyperbolic language of a group like Westboro resembles TTF's style more than anything else.

June 02, 2008 10:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"If you know of anyother harmless group that has been historically oppressed I'm sure LGBT's will support you in calling for an end to their discrimination."

There are many groups that cause less harm and are discriminated against. We can't feasibly remove all injustice by government fiat and if we do so only for some, it is bias.

June 02, 2008 10:24 PM  
Blogger Unknown said...

"A small group of people announced that their morals were offended, it was against their religion to be fair to transgender people, and then they started saying that the law would allow ill-intentioned men -- predators, perverts, and pedophiles -- to lurk in ladies' shower-rooms. […] It is very persuasive because nobody wants to have creepy men in the ladies room, and nobody has the time to go look it up."

Except of course for -- as they would have us believe -- “predators, perverts, and pedophiles.”

It would seem that the premise of their argument rests on the notion that criminals look to the law first, in their effort to break it.

Imbeciles.

June 02, 2008 11:58 PM  
Blogger Unknown said...

Stunning said…
"There are many groups that cause less harm and are discriminated against. We can't feasibly remove all injustice by government fiat and if we do so only for some, it is bias."

A bias which you fully support - as you do not take issue with this same non-discrimination clause when it comes to protecting your brand of religious supremacism.

Using the hypocritical “I’m against ‘bias’” argument in the effort to support bias, is precisely the type of thing that separates you from the Westboro Church.

The Phelps clan isn’t afraid to be thought of as the hateful bigots that they are. They don’t try to hide it. Simply put, they have the courage to be honest about their hatred.

And in that respect, they have more credibility -- even as Christians -- than yourself and your “non-extremist” ilk do.


So yes, there’s quite a difference.

June 03, 2008 1:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You dodged the question, silly anonymous. Read what exodus writes about itself and its movement. Even they say that people are not lgbt by choice. But you already know that, you're just obfuscating.

My comment was, as is obvious to people who read, that the "ex-gay" groups are dropping the choice v. intrinsic quasi-debate for a "impossible to change" v. "really hard but not absolutely impossible to change" dichotomy.

It's actually kind of interesting how even the most anti-gay people are becoming less anti-gay. Times change. The puritan church in New England morphed into todays Unitarians. The Latter-day Saints discovered that polygamy was bad and non-white people could be priests. Maybe one of these days FOF and HRC will merge. Could happen, you know.

I didn't understand the comment about identity theft. Please explicate.

rrjr

June 03, 2008 9:13 AM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "I was referring to polls that match up tickets rather than individual candidates. McCain-Huckabee has recently emerged as the strongest ticket."


The latest poll shows it doesn't matter what the ticket is Mccain is going down. Pay attention.

June 03, 2008 2:54 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "There are many groups that cause less harm and are discriminated against. We can't feasibly remove all injustice by government fiat and if we do so only for some, it is bias.".

LGBTs are harming no one so your point is moot. As it stands we only have anti-discrimination laws for some, like racial minorities and religions so why haven't you been advocating for the repeal of all anti-discrimination laws - because you're a hypocrite. Just because the law can't do a perfect job is no reason to not attempt to do the best job we can. The law can do better with respect to LGBTs and so it should.

June 03, 2008 2:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It is kind of a form of bias. When people have other types of mental illness, we try to help them. When they have gay feelings, we try to not think about it. The government should pay for reparative therapy for these people.

Maybe this type of mental illness can be overcome in our lifetime.

June 03, 2008 3:07 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Don't you love how they undercut all their arguments by demonstrating their personal animus toward GLBT people? They just..can't..make it....stop.

In that vein, did you hear about the dumb group in CA that filed a request for the decision to be stayed? They actually put "scare quotes" around the word marriage in their documents that they submitted to the court.

June 03, 2008 3:49 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "The government should pay for reparative therapy for these people. Maybe this type of mental illness can be overcome in our lifetime.".

A wealth of research since the 1950's has shown that gays are indistinguishable from straights in terms of mental health, obviously it is not a mental illness. "Reparative therapy" fails in the vast majority of cases and serves to further anxiety and depression in those who undergo it with the result sometimes being suicide. "Reparitive therapy" serves merely to increase the social stigmatization which is the sole problem that gay people suffer from. Promoting "reparitive therapy" is akin to beating children to encourage them not to have low self-esteem.

June 03, 2008 4:01 PM  
Blogger Unknown said...

"In that vein, did you hear about the dumb group in CA that filed a request for the decision to be stayed? They actually put "scare quotes" around the word marriage in their documents that they submitted to the court."

Well at least the judges know what they’re thinking now:

Good afternoon your “honor,” and might I add that I have the highest respect for the “authority” of the “court.”

June 03, 2008 4:38 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"serves to further anxiety and depression in those who undergo it with the result sometimes being suicide"

what a lie!

June 03, 2008 6:47 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Priya

Gays are not able to function in a normal sexual way with members of the opposite gender. This is, by definition, a mental illness. They can't easily do what normal people can.

Mental illness is sometimes impairment of the ability to relate to others in a normal way.

Don't despair. Someday, we'll find a cure. Denial is actually a symptom. Obviously, if the government will dedicate some research funds, it will hasten scientific research.

June 03, 2008 6:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Well at least the judges know what they’re thinking now:

Good afternoon your “honor,” and might I add that I have the highest respect for the “authority” of the “court.”"

Un-Emproved has been "thinking" again.

June 03, 2008 7:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Gays are not able to function in a normal sexual way with members of the opposite gender.

Sure they are, take Ted Haggard for example. He managed to father 5 children and keep his wife satisfied and unsuspecting, and yet he's gay.

We can all see who's in denial, dr. p.

Pat

June 04, 2008 7:53 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Sure they are, take Ted Haggard for example. He managed to father 5children and keep his wife satisfied and unsuspecting, and yet he's gay.

We can all see who's in denial, dr. p."

It would be you, Pat.

I find it so interesting that lunatic fringe gay advocates quickly conclude that if someone has engaged in any gay acts, they are gay. Yet, if gays engage in straight sex, they aren't automatically assumed to be straight. It seems that even gay advocates consider homosexuality a particular taint.

What is more interesting is that you confirm something I've always suspected: there is really no such thing as an exclusive gay. All gays can function as straight and thus homosexuality is really a choice. But, if there is someone who is actually gay, that is, they only have the capacity to engage in sexual activities with same sex partners, then that would be a mental illness because their normal functioning is impaired.

We have one contributor here who is fond of saying that gays have always existed in every society. Proof is artwork from the past of guy and guys in suspicious activities and positions. The truth this person doesn't realize is that, in these pagan cultures, exclusive homosexuality was unknown and those who engaged in same sex activity generally had wifes and families. These pagan cultures, unenlightened by Judeo-Christian influence, viewed this as a form of male bonding. Exclusive homosexaulity, as being promoted by lunatic fringers, is a relatively recent phenomenom, arising in the last century and a half. It's more a rebellion against conventional society than a reality.

June 04, 2008 10:07 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous, don't you get tired?

rrjr

June 04, 2008 12:33 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Only sybil-anon would think that Ted Haggard, a man who calls himself "straight" while carrying on with gay hookers in his secret life, confirms something about all people. Is sybil going to share her secret life with us? I hope not, that'd be TMI!

All gays can function as straight and thus homosexuality is really a choice.

All people can function either way. That doesn't mean the majority must force the minority to behave like they do. How would you like it if the majority and minority were reversed and you were forced to behave in a way that was offensive to you?

This is America, we are all free and each of us has certain unalienable rights including, as the courts in California have found, the right to pursue happiness, as long as it harms no others.

June 04, 2008 2:24 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "Gays are not able to function in a normal sexual way with members of the opposite gender. This is, by definition, a mental illness." and then "All gays can function as straight and thus homosexuality is really a choice.".

Thanks for confirming so vividly that you couldn't care less about the truth, you'll say anything as long as its anti-gay. So which is it anon-freak, a choice or a mental illness? I'll help you, its neither. No medical or mental health professional considers being gay a disease nor heterosexual sex to be necessary to healthy day to day living. No medical or mental health professional organization considers sexual orientation to be a choice - did you choose your heterosexuality? In fact even the groups promoting "reparative therapy" like PFXOX and Exodus state that gayness is not a choice.

June 04, 2008 6:43 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "gay advocates quickly conclude that if someone has engaged in any gay acts, they are gay. Yet, if gays engage in straight sex, they aren't automatically assumed to be straight.".

Gays don't assume that to be strictly the case, however as a normal course of being some people have straight sex to hide the fact that they are gay whereas no one has gay sex to hide the fact that they are straight. That's why its generally a safe assumption that if someone has gay sex its because they are same sex attracted but if someone has straight sex that is no guarantee that they are primarily opposite sex attracted.

June 04, 2008 6:48 PM  
Blogger Priya Lynn said...

Red Baron said "in these pagan cultures, exclusive gayness was unknown and those who engaged in same sex activity generally had wifes and families.".

Your wish that that be so is in no way proof that it is. There is no reason to believe that exculsive gayness has not always existed just as it has today - in fact it is preposterous to assume otherwise.

Red Baron said "These pagan cultures, unenlightened by Judeo-Christian influence, viewed this as a form of male bonding.".

A religion that teaches people should be eternally punished for acts that harm no one is as far from enlightened as you can get.

Red Baron siad "Exclusive gayness, as being promoted by lunatic fringers, is a relatively recent phenomenom, arising in the last century and a half. It's more a rebellion against conventional society than a reality.

Catholic wedding ceremonies from the 14th century where gay men pledged to love each other forever and sealed it with a kiss is proof that you don't know what you're talking about.

June 04, 2008 6:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

andrea-not anon
Why does whoknowswho anon not recognize that the only lunatic here is him?

June 05, 2008 9:06 AM  

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