Sunday, May 13, 2012

Contrasting Viewpoints


Lincoln, Nebraska is considering passage of an ordinance that would extend legal anti-discrimination protection to gay and transgender people in housing, employment and public accommodations.  The city council was taking public comments.  I thought you would find a couple of them interesting.

Here is someone opposed to the ordinance.  This is classic, it's like the whole Citizens for Responsible Whatever rolled into one:


And here is a PFLAG mom.  She was sitting behind the lady in the first video.


43 Comments:

Blogger Hazumu Osaragi said...

Just FYI:

"A video of a woman testifying against the anti-discrimination ordinance at the Lincoln City Council this week went viral, but her family says she is diagnosed with schizophrenia and shouldn’t be taken seriously. Jane Svoboda, 52, made several bizarre and disjointed statements during her five minutes of testimony at Monday’s meeting.

..Svoboda lives at an assisted-living facility in Lincoln and is listed as a protected person, according to court documents. Her brother, Patrick Svoboda of Ogallala, is her conservator because she is incompetent, the documents say."


I'd say that in a schizophrenic, word-salad-ey way, Ms. Svoboda has regurgitated all the worst talking points of the the anti-gay (and CRW) crowd. But because of her mental illness, she's nought but a parrot mimicking the lines she has been exposed to.

May 13, 2012 7:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is extremely similar to things we have heard Ruth Jacobs say many times in public comments in Montgomery County. There is no mental-health criterion for participating in public affairs, and there is no way to ensure that mentally ill people are evaluated and treated. So you have to take everybody seriously, even the nutty ones.

May 13, 2012 8:29 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

fascinating

still, there is no justification for cluttering up the law with a bunch of dubious laws of subjective nature

besides, the woman may have some points

how we've come to regard the perversion of homosexuality as sacred and beyond question is preposterous

May 13, 2012 8:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Much of Hollywood may be toasting the president for announcing he personally supports gay marriage, but Howard Stern isn't having any of it.

At a press conference about his new "America's Got Talent" judging duties, the radio host told reporters that his "feelings are very clear on this."

"I wish the president actually had gone further. I wish he said he was going to back some legislation on the national level," Stern said.

Some are taking issue with the timing and content of Obama's announcement, noting that it took the president well into the third year of his term to concede that he believed same-sex couples should be able to marry. Obama also did not endorse any federal legislation on the matter.

Stern found the move calculated and said, "It's a baby step."

"Will and Grace" co-creator Max Mutchnick called the president's statement "very choreographed" and revealed that Joe Biden teased the comments the vice president made on "Meet the Press" during an earlier, private function. Biden later famously said he believed "'Will and Grace' probably did more to educate the American public than almost anything anyone's ever done so far."

Obama's announcement came just days later, causing some to speculate that Biden's surprising comment may have forced the president's hand. To continue to hedge on gay marriage risked alienating a key constituency within his base.

Until his announcement Wednesday, the administration had described the president's views on the issue as "evolving."

Obama's campaign launched a new ad after his announcement, blasting Mitt Romney as "backwards on equality" and highlighting the president's new position.

May 13, 2012 8:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bt election day Romney is going to lok like the dumbest asshole ever if he lets Obama back him into this hater corner.

May 13, 2012 8:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

hater corner?

nobody, not one person, anywhere in the land will change their vote from Romney to Obama because Romney favors retaining marriage

plenty of people, however, will change from Obama to Romney because Obama favors eliminating marriage as we know it

worse for Barry, those people are all from states where he was barely hanging on anyway

those states, known as swing states, will tip the election

his fantasy is that gays will ignite passion among liberals

he is searching for ways to excite his base

Trayvon Martin, the war on women, the interest rates on student loans...

it's sad

because while he struggles to turn America into a snarling partisan country in a desperate attempt to save his Presidency, he has sacrificed the one thing he had going for himself:

likability

May 13, 2012 9:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Go ahead, anon, beleve that. If he's lucky, by November Romney might get the same percentage of the vote that George Wallace did.

May 13, 2012 10:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wallace never lead in National polls, as Romney currently does

even if he's lucky, by November Obama might not get the same percentage of the vote that Jimmy Carter did when he ran for re-election

May 14, 2012 5:43 AM  
Anonymous Reality check with hard facts said...

Here are the latest favorability poll averages from RCP.

Obama 51.2% favorable, 43.7 unfavorable, +7.5 spread

Romney 37.7% favorable, 41.7 unfavorable, -4.0 spread

May 14, 2012 7:17 AM  
Anonymous Reality check with more hard facts said...

Mitt Romney says "Marriage has been one man and one woman for 3000 years."

But the fact is Mitt Romney's great great grand-father had 12 wives and his great grandfather had 5 wives. In fact DeseretNews.com reports:

"Polygamy was not just a historical footnote but a prominent element in the family tree of the former Massachusetts governor now seeking to become the first LDS president.

Romney's great-grandfather, Miles Park Romney, married his fifth wife in 1897. That was more than six years after LDS church leaders banned polygamy and more than three decades after a federal law barred the practice.

Romney's great-grandmother, Hannah Hood Hill, was the daughter of polygamists. She wrote vividly in her autobiography about how she "used to walk the floor and shed tears of sorrow" over her own husband's multiple marriages.

Romney's great-great-grandfather Parley P. Pratt, an apostle in the church, had 12 wives. In an 1852 sermon, Parley P. Pratt's brother and fellow apostle, Orson Pratt, became the first church official to publicly proclaim and defend polygamy as a direct revelation from God.

Romney's father, former Michigan Gov. George Romney, was born in Chihuahua, Mexico, where church members fled in the 1800s to escape religious persecution and U.S. laws forbidding polygamy. He and his family did not return to the United States until 1912, more than two decades after the church issued "The Manifesto" banning polygamy.

"When you read the family's history, you realize how important polygamy was to them," said Todd Compton, a Mormon and independent historian who wrote a book about the polygamous life of the church's founder, Joseph Smith. "....

May 14, 2012 8:53 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"But because of her mental illness, she's nought but a parrot mimicking the lines she has been exposed to."

Homophobia *is* a mental illness. Sboboda is not the only one exhibiting symptoms. So is her supporter who thinks "the woman may have some points."

May 14, 2012 9:04 AM  
Anonymous Teach your parents well said...

Pew Research Center: Growing Public Support for Same-Sex Marriage

Gallup.com: Half of Americans Support Legal Gay Marriage

Rasmussen Reports: Same-Sex Marriage Moving Toward the Mainstream

Fox News reports:

...While separating the personal from the political is impossible in the president's case, others who have moved in the same direction on the issue say they immediately recognized themselves in Obama's remarks. Once comfortably opposed, they found their views shifting as a result of sometimes uncomfortable dialogues taking place at churches, workplaces, soccer fields and statehouses.

"I had the same conversation with my daughter," New York Assemblywoman Sandra Galef, a Democrat representing the Manhattan suburbs in Westchester County. "My daughter told me, 'Mom, you're old fashioned. What difference does it make if people love each other? Everyone should have their rights.' She really just totally disagreed with her mom." [She's not the only one.]

Galef, 72, credits those talks with moving her from voting in 2009 against a bill that would have legalized same-sex unions in the state to voting for a similar bill two years later.

"My daughter, I think, really opened my eyes to the fact that I grew up in a different age and just made it so clear that I wasn't thinking like a more modern person on this topic," she said. "When the president said this, I could just relate to myself having gone through the whole scenario."

Before Obama became the first sitting president to endorse marriage rights for same-sex couples, other politicians had attributed changes of heart on the issue to having gay people leading comfortably conventional lives in their worlds. The leader of the Iowa Senate, Mike Gronstal, held back a constitutional amendment that would have banned gay marriage in his state in 2009 after his daughter changed his mind on the subject. Former Vice President Dick Cheney and San Diego Mayor Jerry Saunders also came out for same-sex marriage after learning their daughters were lesbians....

May 14, 2012 9:25 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Here are the latest favorability poll averages from RCP."

thanks for the "hard fact"

let's see, according the link you provided, about a month ago, on the same date, ABC and CNN said Obama had a positive 20 spread for favorability

two days later, CBS and Quinnipiac said he was at negative 4

a week later, FOX had him at plus 2

now, one lone poll has him at plus 20

when you average poll numbers with that kind of divergence, that's not a hard fact

it's a desperate propaganda ploy

May 14, 2012 12:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"But the fact is Mitt Romney's great great grand-father had 12 wives and his great grandfather had 5 wives."

nice fact

I guess you don't mind if we attack Obama based on his parents' behavior then

you may remember that Utah wasn't allow to join the Union until Mormons denounced polygamy

we should kick out Maryland if they don't vote against gay "marriage" in November

May 14, 2012 12:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Obama is the son of a polygamist.

May 14, 2012 12:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Homophobia *is* a mental illness. Sboboda is not the only one exhibiting symptoms. So is her supporter who thinks "the woman may have some points.""

and thinking that anyone who disagrees with the gay agenda or doesn't hold a fairy tale view of homosexuality has a mental illness is a phobia to be named later

one myth that the gay agenda has tried to popularize is that homosexual behavior is not dangerous

and, of course, under carefully controlled situations, one can do that kind of stuff without much risk

but in the real world, there is a strong possibility that any given homosexual romantic encounter could be fatal

homosexuals are well aware of this and it shouldn't be surprising to hear that they seek certain low-risk partners to minimize the risk

you saying that doesn't happen?

May 14, 2012 12:46 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rep. James Lankford said in a recent interview that he was against laws designed to protect employees from workplace discrimination based on their sexual orientation, because of his belief that being gay is a choice.

"Race and sexual preferences are two different things. One is a behavior-related and preference-related and one is something inherent -- skin color, something obvious, that kind of stuff. You don’t walk up to someone on the street and look at them and say gay or straight" Lankford said. "I think it’s a choice issue. Are there tendencies? Yes. But I think it’s a choice issue, nonetheless."

President Barack Obama's recent endorsement of same-sex marriage rights spurred a group of senators to call for hearings on the Employment Non-Discrimination Act, a piece of legislation that would expand employee anti-discrimination language to include sexual orientation and gender identity.

Lankford isn't the only congressman to express opposition to this type of bill. Last week, Rep. Allen West said such protections were unnecessary because discrimination based on sexual orientation simply didn't happen.

"That doesn’t happen here in the United States of America." he said.

May 14, 2012 1:31 PM  
Anonymous David S. Fishback said...

The issue, really, is not whether Governor Romney's or President Obama's forebearers were polygamous. That has nothing to do with either man, both of whom appear to be staunchly and happily monogamous.

But what is curious is this: How can Governor Romney say with a straight face that marriage has always been between one man and one woman, when his own family background (and a reading of the Old Testament) demonstrates that that is not the case? Polygamy has a long -- and biblical -- history.

And even more striking is that, as a devout Mormon, one would think that Governor Romney believes that plural marriage was, in fact, sanctioned by God until God revealed a change in policy to the LDS Elders in 1896 (conveniently, at the time when they wanted Utah to be admitted to the Union as a state).

So if God had a change of mind in 1896 about plural marriage, how can the Governor be so sure that God has not "changed His mind" with respect to same sex marriage in the early 20th Century? Or perhaps he and the people in charge of the LDS in Utah are awaiting yet another Divine Revelation, just as they did in the 1978 when God told them to no longer discriminate against those of African descent. (I remember hearing Governor Romney say, when he was running for president in 2008, how happy he was when that change occurred -- even saying it brought him to tears. Why not the same compassion for gay people?)

My main point here is that the LDS experience on plural marriage and racial discrimination, taken on its own terms, would seem to confirm the United Church of Christ mantra that "God is still speaking." Perhaps Governor Romney and many others need to listen more closely.

May 14, 2012 1:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

David, Mormons are nuts, obviously. Mitt Romney was unfortunate enough to be born into it.

But, now, he's running for President to represent broader America. And his speech was not an attempt to speak for Mormonism but for the values of America.

Americans who vote don't believe marriage has a definition that includes homosexuality.

We are a nation with a judeo-Christian heritage and, thus, unlike most if the world, we have compassion for and tolerance of homosexuals.

At the same time, we have a moral vision that holds families as a foundation of a strong society.

Tha gay agenda will ultimately fail here.

May 14, 2012 2:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Mormons are nuts, obviously."

Romney was born that way!

May 14, 2012 3:10 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Look who has nothing to say about the wide variety of polls showing the steady march from disapproval of same-sex marriage to approval of it. The silent majority folks still mostly disapprove of same sex marriage, but as they die off, the Millennials who approve of marriage equality by wide margins, will be the voters who decide.

Cling to the votes of the past as long as you must, but they will have no effect on the votes to come.

Cue Dylan -- once again, the times are a'changin.

May 14, 2012 3:27 PM  
Anonymous David S. Fishback said...

Anon,

I don't think it is fair to so characterize Mormons unless you are prepared to so characterize every religion that has supernatural origin stories.

My point is not about what "Americans think" at the moment -- although pluralities and majorities are trending in favor of civil marriage equality.

Rather, my point is that there is something curious about a candidate who invokes an analysis that is so at odds with portions of what he knows and believes. Now I don't think that Romney is not expressing what he thinks about same sex marriage -- but I think it is worthwhile to note that much of what underlies his argument is demonstrably false, even on his own terms.

I agree that families are "a foundation of a strong society." That is why it is important to strengthen support for all families -- not just those of straight couples.

You say "we have compassion for and tolerance of homosexuals." Well, your approach may be tolerant, in the narrow sense that you would not imprison or physically attack them. Gee, thanks. But opposing same sex couples' ability to have the rights, responsibilities, and of marriage does not show compassion. It shows unnecessary hurtfulness.

May 14, 2012 3:48 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

David, David...

I never said Mormons are nuts because they believe in the existence of a reality beyond our universe. I don't even know if they do believe that. I think they're nuts because their theology is so mixeed-up.

If it makes you feel any better, I also think the same about the materialists and atheists who frequent this blog.

"Well, your approach may be tolerant, in the narrow sense that you would not imprison or physically attack them. Gee, thanks."

well, you're welcome

we also wouldn't favor any other governmentally imposed penalty on them

so, why can't your friends extend the same tolerance to Christians?

"But opposing same sex couples' ability to have the rights, responsibilities, and of marriage does not show compassion. It shows unnecessary hurtfulness."

what we don't want is for endorsement of or association with homosexuals to be enforced by governmental action

ultimately, laws are enforced by physical coercion

we just want the government to limit itself to protecting the right to pursue one's own self-determined route to happiness and not be forced to support things we don't believe in

"Hope Decker and Tiffany Wright, a same-sex couple at Lexington Catholic High School in Lexington, Ky., were barred from attending the school's prom because their relationship violated the Catholic church's position on homosexuality."

so, what's the problem?

if they want to have gay couples at the prom, go to a school where that is compatible with the school's beliefs

why do they want to go somewhere where they agree with the principles being taught?

"Decker, 18, and Wright, 16, were told by school officials they could not attend the school event, despite having already purchased their dresses,"

oh, well

if they bought dresses, that changes everything

"As a Catholic high school, we uphold every teaching of the Catholic Church," Lexington Catholic High School President Steve Angelucci said. "The policies and procedures of our school reflect those teachings."

"What I experienced in the Dean's Office was blatant homophobia," one of the lesbians said.

Wright told the station that, while they were upset at first, they soon decided to take action.

"I mean, we both cried and then I was like, this is ridiculous," Wright said. "There's gotta be something we could do about this."

So, instead of going home, the couple and their friends held their own prom in the school's parking lot with the help of some car stereos for music."

ooo00ooo, that showed 'em

"On Monday, Rep. James Clyburn (D-S.C.), a long-serving congressman and civil rights icon, said he disagrees with Obama on gay marriage. Echoing comments made to the Columbia Free-Times on Saturday, Clyburn told MSNBC host Chuck Todd that "I, like the President, have evolved."

Obama has earned the praise of gay rights activists since the announcement, and was even declared the "first gay president" in an infamous Newsweek cover where he appeared underneath a rainbow-colored halo."

May 14, 2012 5:47 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

CBS NY Times poll released today

Romney ahead by 3

Newsweek calls Obama first gay President, visible at supermarket checkouts across the land

three months from now, pollsters and pundits will wonder why significant portion of Americans consider Obama to be Kenyan, Muslim and gay

May 14, 2012 11:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Look who's citing a poll of 562 Registered (not Likely) Voters while skipping over Gallup's poll of 2200 Registered (not Likely) Voters showing Obama ahead. Both polls are within the margin of error.

Apparently 562 Registered Voters count only when they agree with Anon.

And then there are these pesky facts reported by Gallup in U.S. Acceptance of Gay/Lesbian Relations Is the New Normal.

Here's Gallup's "Bottom Line" in that report published just yesterday:

Americans' acceptance of gays and lesbians as equal members of society has increased steadily in the past decade to the point that half or more now agree that being gay is morally acceptable, that gay relations ought to be legal, and that gay or lesbian couples should have the right to legally marry. While public support has been trending upward, support on all three measures was slightly higher in 2011 than in the new 2012 poll, suggesting attitudes may be leveling off -- at least for the time being. However, they are stabilizing at a point that makes President Obama's decision to publicly support gay marriage much less controversial than it would have been even four years ago. Significant pockets of resistance remain -- namely Republicans, those 55 and older, Protestants, residents of the South, and, in some respects, men -- but majorities of other groups have grown comfortable with gay rights.

May 15, 2012 7:55 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The current issue of Newsweek has a photo of President Obama with a rainbow-colored halo superimposed over his head and the title “The First Gay President.”

Nonsense. Obama is not the first gay president. He is the first female president.

Consider his activities on Monday: He sat down to tape a session with the ladies of ABC’s “The View” — his fourth appearance on the talk show by women and for women. He accepted an award from Barnard College and gave the commencement speech to graduates of the women’s school. Heck, he even appeared in public wearing a gown.

Obama was still early in his address when he acknowledged that his praise for the young generation of women is “a cheap applause line when you’re giving a commencement at Barnard.”

But Obama was being modest. He didn’t deliver a cheap applause line. He delivered an entire speech full of them. His reelection campaign has been working for months to create a gender gap. But Monday’s activities veered into pandering, as Obama brazenly flaunted his feminine mystique.

He speculated that “Congress would get a lot more done” if more women were there. He speculated that, although no women signed the Constitution, “we can assume that there were founding mothers whispering smarter things in the ears of the founding fathers.”

He announced that “more and more women are out-earning their husbands. You’re more than half of our college graduates and master’s graduates and PhDs.” He told them that they are “poised to make this the century where women shape not only their own destiny but the destiny of this nation and of this world.”

And they can look good doing it! “You can be stylish and powerful, too,” he said. “That’s Michelle’s advice.” The first lady, the couple’s two daughters, and the president’s mother and mother-in-law had recurring roles as “strong, remarkable women” in the speech.

There were some ironies in the appearance. When the White House asked Barnard for the commencement speaking role, the college dumped its original speaker, Jill Abramson. In addition to being an actual woman, Abramson is the first of her sex to become executive editor of the New York Times.

Barnard President Debora Spar, bestowing a medal on Obama, lauded his support of same-sex marriage and his furthering of “a whole lot smarter world.” More helpful to Obama’s theme was Spar’s praise of his appointment of a “long list of gifted and remarkable women leaders.”

Obama had a list of his own — an itemization of the various things he has done for women, from signing the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act to his appointment of Susan Rice as ambassador to the United Nations. He said that his labor secretary was told by her high school guidance counselor that she “should think about becoming a secretary. . . . And, lo and behold, Hilda Solis did end up becoming a secretary.”

The young women applauded and cheered lines about “equal pay for equal work,” controlling “decisions about your own health” and many others. “We are better off when women are treated fairly and equally in every aspect of American life,” Obama told them, urging them to “fight for a seat at the head of the table.”

Obama tone seemed more suited to campaign than campus, particularly when he, toward the end, lifted lines from his stump speech. “If you’re willing to reach up and close that gap between what America is and what America should be,” he said, raising his voice, “I want you to know that I will be right there with you.”

The president departed — he had to get to Barbara, Whoopi, Joy, Elisabeth and Sherri — but not before sharing hugs and kisses with the other women onstage.

May 15, 2012 8:01 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

three months from now, pollsters and pundits will wonder why significant portion of Americans consider Obama to be Kenyan, Muslim and gay

If they do, it'll be because of KKK money - Karl, Koch & Koch - and the misinformation it pedaled.

May 15, 2012 8:01 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Look who's citing a poll of 562 Registered (not Likely) Voters while skipping over Gallup's poll of 2200 Registered (not Likely) Voters showing Obama ahead. Both polls are within the margin of error."

yes, but wasn't Obama comfortably ahead not long ago?

like, before he became the first gay President?

"And then there are these pesky facts reported by Gallup in U.S. Acceptance of Gay/Lesbian Relations Is the New Normal."

"pesky" is kind of a gay word, isn't it?

"Americans' acceptance of gays and lesbians as equal members of society has increased steadily in the past decade to the point that half or more now agree that being gay is morally acceptable, that gay relations ought to be legal, and that gay or lesbian couples should have the right to legally marry."

there have been other times when society was more gay tolerant

a backlash always surfaces

additionally, gay "marriage" usually sounds fine to most people until there is a referendum and public discussion

rational discussion is not the friend of lunatic fringe gay advocacy

"While public support has been trending upward, support on all three measures was slightly higher in 2011 than in the new 2012 poll, suggesting attitudes may be leveling off"

when something is not as high as last year, that's not "leveling off"

that's reversal

the English language is never safe when lunatic fringe gay advocates are around

maybe the beginning of the latest backlash

"-- at least for the time being."

and here we have an assertion without any basis in reality

"However, they are stabilizing at a point that makes President Obama's decision to publicly support gay marriage much less controversial than it would have been even four years ago. Significant pockets of resistance remain -- namely Republicans, those 55 and older, Protestants, residents of the South, and, in some respects, men"

oh, just them...and 32 states who have gay "marriage" banned in their state constitutions

"-- but majorities of other groups have grown comfortable with gay rights"

we're all comfortable with gay rights

what we need to avoid is giving gays privileges and preferences and calling that "rights"

the English language under attack by gays again

May 15, 2012 8:14 AM  
Anonymous jolly good show in ol' Virginny said...

Virginia state Del. Bob Marshall has launched an effort to block an openly gay judge from being considered for a post on a general district court.

Marshall said he believes that Tracy Thorne-Begland, a Richmond-based prosecutor who lives with his partner and two adopted children, should be removed from the list of potential appointees. Thorne-Begland's sexual orientation would conflict with his ability to hold up the state's constitution, Marshall said.

"Marriage is between one man and one woman, and the the applicant has represented himself in public in a relationship that we don't recognize in Virginia," Marshall said.

The GOP lawmaker said that Thorne-Begland is "an aggressive activist for the pro-homosexual agenda."

May 15, 2012 10:31 AM  
Anonymous no refunds said...

An openly gay Mitt Romney donor has decided to pull his support for the presumptive GOP nominee and instead support President Obama's reelection bid, citing the former Massachusetts governor's opposition to same-sex marriage as a dealbreaker.

"I feel that I no longer wish to support your presidential campaign and ask you that you please return the maximum contribution that I gave to you last year," Bill White wrote in a letter to Romney. "You have chosen to be on the wrong side of history and I do not support your run for president any longer."

White, a registered independent who runs a New York-based consulting firm, had given $2,500 to the Romney campaign.

White made his decision following Obama's announcement last week that he supports same-sex marriage. While he clarified that he does not agree with the president on fiscal issues, White said that Romney's speech during Liberty University's commencement on Saturday led him to believe that Romney would press for a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage -- a position that White simply cannot support.

"I feel like Romney has declared war on my marriage," White said. "And I could just sit back and not say anything. Or I could do something about it. And I've chosen to do something about it."

May 15, 2012 10:38 AM  
Anonymous Robert said...

The Virginia House voted down Tracy Thorne-Begland's judgeship simply because of his sexual orientation.

This from the home of Loving v. Virginia and Masive Resistance; Virginia continues in it's cultural and political traditions.

May 15, 2012 12:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The Virginia House voted down Tracy Thorne-Begland's judgeship simply because of his sexual orientation."

that's right, Robert

this person did not support the Virginia state constitution so it would be insane to make them a judge in Virginia

you're familiar with insanity, aren't you?

May 15, 2012 1:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Romney’s Liberty University address on Saturday was more than good. It gave evidence of creative, lively intelligence somewhere near the center of the Romney campaign machine.

The speech performed a number of moves that carry a high degree of difficulty. Its language was fresh and graceful. The students heard that their faith “demands and creates heroic souls” — a phrase that deserves remembering. Romney strategically conceded the theological tensions between Mormons and evangelicals — “people of different faiths, like yours and mine” — but described a broad overlap on matters of service and morality. His depiction of this shared moral ideal was ethically rich: “justice for the persecuted, compassion for the needy and the sick, or mercy for the child waiting to be born.”

Romney managed to praise Rick Santorum while demonstrating an appealing alternative to Santorum’s tone. Romney emphasized that "men and women of every faith, and good people with none at all, sincerely strive to do right and lead a purpose-driven life." There were deft references to evangelical heroes — William Wilberforce, Dietrich Bonhoeffer, C.S. Lewis, Charles Colson — throughout the speech.

But the most interesting element of the Liberty address was its main argument. Romney claimed that culture is the key to civilizational success — and that American culture is shaped by Jewish and Christian values such as the priority of the individual, personal responsibility and the dignity of work. These values, in turn, are strengthened in religious institutions and traditional families. Agree or disagree, Romney set out a sophisticated case for cultural conservatism: that liberal public institutions depend on virtues and values shaped in conservative social institutions.

Contrast this to the way President Obama has often approached social issues. He justified his recent switch on gay marriage, in part, as the direct application of Christian teaching. “When we think about our faith,” he said, “the thing at root that we think about is, not only Christ sacrificing himself on our behalf, but it’s also the Golden Rule, you know, treat others the way you would want to be treated.” In 2008, he justified his support for civil unions by saying: “If people find that controversial, then I would just refer them to the Sermon on the Mount, which I think is, in my mind, for my faith, more central than an obscure passage in Romans.” During this year’s National Prayer Breakfast, Obama justified raising taxes on the rich by contending it “coincides with Jesus’s teaching that ‘for unto whom much is given, much shall be required.’ ”

Agree or disagree with the policies Obama recommends, his arguments can’t be called sophisticated. They are the liberal political application of a “What Would Jesus Do?” wristband. In a mirror reflection of the religious right, Obama has a tendency to engage in partisan proof texting — which is divisive in service to any ideology. Saying “I would just refer them to the Sermon on the Mount” is a claim of divine authority that short-circuits democratic debate. Even when Obama changes his political views, Jesus somehow comes around to agreeing with him.

Injecting religion into politics is always a tricky business. Religiously informed moral beliefs about human rights and dignity have public consequences — properly debated on issues from abortion to gay rights. But the use of faith and scripture as partisan trump cards is bad for religion and for politics. On recent evidence, it is Romney who is more sensitive to the danger.

May 15, 2012 1:18 PM  
Anonymous Obama the First said...

according to a poll taken by the NY Times, 67% of Americans believe Obama's decision to become the first gay President was taken for political reasons; 27% believed he was trying to do the right thing:

"President Obama openly spoke of repealing the Defense of Marriage Act at a fundraiser Monday, as he promoted his personal view that gay couples should have the right to marry.

The call for repeal was one of a list of policy goals for what he hopes will be a second term.

"We have never gone wrong when we expanded rights and responsibilities to everybody," Obama said. "That doesn't weaken families, that strengthens families."

The president's recent schedule reflects a robust push by the Obama campaign to trumpet, not downplay, the president's decision last week to support same-sex marriage -- a historic first for a sitting U.S. president.

Even the commencement address Obama delivered at Barnard College in New York on Monday afternoon had a same-sex marriage tinge -- he shared the stage with Evan Wolfson, founder of the gay advocacy group Freedom to Marry, and touched on the issue briefly in his remarks.

"No matter who you love or what God you worship, you can still pursue happiness -- I will support you every step of the way," Obama said.

The campaign last week released a web video heralding the announcement, while casting Romney as "backwards on equality." The president went on to raise nearly $15 million Thursday night from donors attending a campaign event at George Clooney's house."

May 15, 2012 1:51 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

ROFL in the USA

May 15, 2012 5:24 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

On page 173 of the course catalog for Liberty University (http://www.liberty.edu/media/1109/2011-2012-LU-Graduate-Catalog.pdf), the country's largest Evangelical Christian college, there's a graduate course labeled Theology 678—Western and New Religions.

Its innocuous title belies the description of its curriculum:

"The history, doctrines, and present state of the major cults such as Mormonism, Christian Science, Jehovah's Witnesses and Seventh Day Adventism. The course will also include a study of the Occult Movement. Emphasis is placed on the errors of these groups and on methods and materials for confronting them effectively."

May 15, 2012 9:28 PM  
Anonymous Robert said...

Anonymous concludes his above response about Virginia politics with a snide ad homonem comment. His teachers must be proud.

May 15, 2012 10:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

no need to pull out the course catalog, TTFer

Baptists, and all orthodox Christian groups, definitely considerate Mormonism a cult

Romney however is not making a case for endorsing his religion but that we share a common moral vision

btw, the church Obama attended for decades would also cause problems for the Liberty U crowd

poor Robert, he was ad hommed

the poor dear fellow

meanwhile, one thing we can say for sure is that Obama has ended the era where blacks vote 95% Democratic:

"The pulpits of the nation's black churches took measure Sunday of President Obama's decision to support gay marriage.

Some churches were silent on the issue. At others, pastors spoke against the president's decision Wednesday -- but kindly of the man himself. A few blasted the president and his decision. A tiny minority spoke in favor of the decision and expressed understanding of the president's change of heart.

Bishop Timothy Clarke, head of the First Church of God, a large African-American church with a television ministry in Columbus, Ohio, was perhaps most typical. He felt compelled to address the president's comments at a Wednesday evening service and again Sunday morning. He was responding to an outpouring of calls, emails and text messages from members of his congregation after the president's remarks.

What did he hear from churchgoers? "No church or group is monolithic. Some were powerfully agitated and disappointed. Others were curious -- why now? to what end? Others were hurt."

What did the bishop tell his congregation? He opposes gay marriage. It is not just a social issue, he said, but a religious one for those who follow the Bible. "The spiritual issue is ground in the word of God."

The conflicted sentiments within African-American churches reflect a broader struggle in the American public. A USA Today Poll showed that slightly more than half of Americans agreed with the president's decision. But past polls have shown blacks generally opposed to gay marriage.

African-Americans are a key voting bloc for the president this November. In 2008, exit polls showed Obama lost to John McCain among white voters but won more than 95% of the African-American vote.

Dwight McKissic, senior pastor at the Cornerstone Baptist Church in Arlington, Texas, said last week he would not speak on gay marriage Sunday because it was Mother's Day and his wife would lead the church.

However, he planned to focus directly on the topic in next week's sermon. "President Obama has betrayed the Bible and the black church with his endorsement of same-sex marriage," McKissic said."

May 15, 2012 11:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

where's the like button?

Virgina, land of uncommonly common sense

standing up to the gay agenda

May 16, 2012 8:28 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Gallup reports: May 9, 2012
Gender Gap in Obama Approval Constant Since Term Began


Approval is five to six percentage points higher among women than among men
by Steve Crabtree

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- Women have consistently been more likely than men to say they approve of President Barack Obama's job performance since his administration began in January 2009. Regardless of changes in the president's overall approval rating over the past three years, which has ranged from a monthly low of 41% to a high of 66% among all Americans, the gender gap each month has generally held steady at about five to six percentage points. Most recently, in April, 50% of women approved of Obama's performance, vs. 44% of men.

...Within each of the two major parties, the gender gap virtually disappears. That is, Republican women are not significantly more likely than Republican men to approve of Obama, and the same is true of Democratic women vs. men.

However, the other aspect contributing to the gender gap is that women who identify as political independents are slightly more likely than their male counterparts to approve of Obama. Here also, the gap has been consistent since the early days of Obama's presidency, at about four percentage points. Forty-six percent of female independents in April 2012 approved of Obama, vs. 42% of male independents....

May 16, 2012 8:30 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Divorce is a perversion of marriage. It's about time that we amend the Constitution of the United States to ban divorce. Think of what that could do for the Value of American Families!

May 16, 2012 10:34 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"President Barack Obama’s endorsement of gay marriage may have caused a shift in opinion on the issue among African-Americans. Polling has shown that large numbers of African-Americans found gay marriage unacceptable — but a new Washington Post-ABC News poll shows more than half now support it.

According to the poll, 54 percent of African-Americans have a favorable impression of the president’s endorsement of gay marriage while 37 percent have an unfavorable view. In November, a Washington Post-Kaiser Family Foundation poll found 58 percent of African-Americans called same-sex marriage “unacceptable” while just 35 percent said it was “acceptable.”

"Overall, the poll found that among registered voters, 46 percent approved of the president’s statement and 46 percent opposed it. Some 70 percent of Democrats and 49 percent of independents held favorable views while 76 percent of Republicans held unfavorable views.

Those under age 30 supported the president by about 60 percent with a similar number of seniors opposed to it, the Post noted."

May 16, 2012 10:34 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The George Carlin & Scott Walker Clip Every American Needs to See

May 16, 2012 6:15 PM  

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